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A community for the dragon language of The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

The Divinity of the Divines

 1 

volzah zol
February 7, 2016

As a side topic that popped up in another thread, I decided to start a whole new thread on this. The debate is whether or not the Aedra, the Divines, are truly ‘immortal’. The short answer is no, they can be killed. The long answer is a little more complicated. 

The Aedra, who sacrificed much of their power to the creation of Mundus, were part of the Et’Ada, the Original Spirits. These spirits were not immortal. After the creation of Nirn, those Et’Ada who didn’t choose to say on Nirn as spirits, or manage to escape, simply faded away into nothingness. In fact, even the Daedra, who are more powerful than the Aedra, aren’t immortal. They can be killed, just not in the realm of Mundus. They can only be killed in their realm of Oblivion. 

Now, looking at immortality from the perspective of souls, rather than physical forms, we get a very interesting outcome. In the case of dragons, they’re considered ‘immortal’ because even if their bodies die and decay, their souls continue to exist. But by this definition, so do the ‘mortal’ races. If a Nord dies, his soul lives eternally in Sovngarde, Mortals who pledged themselves to the service of Daedra will find their souls living eternally in the realm of Oblivion of their chosen Daedra. Souls may be trapped and exist forever inside of Soul Cairns. So using that model, ALL creatures ‘could’ be immortal. Except the Aedra. The Aedra have no special place to go when they die. No Soul Cairn, or realm of Oblivion where they will continue to exist. They simply die. Vanish. Gone forever, like their Et’Ada siblings who faded away into nothing. 

My take on this is that the Divines are rather powerless, by comparison. Sure, no one has ever killed a god, but this doesn’t mean it’s not possible to do so. After all, if Tamriel is known for anything, it should be that every era or so, someone comes along and achieves the otherwise impossible. 

This is why I say the gods are not immortal. 

by volzah zol
February 7, 2016

As a side topic that popped up in another thread, I decided to start a whole new thread on this. The debate is whether or not the Aedra, the Divines, are truly ‘immortal’. The short answer is no, they can be killed. The long answer is a little more complicated. 

The Aedra, who sacrificed much of their power to the creation of Mundus, were part of the Et’Ada, the Original Spirits. These spirits were not immortal. After the creation of Nirn, those Et’Ada who didn’t choose to say on Nirn as spirits, or manage to escape, simply faded away into nothingness. In fact, even the Daedra, who are more powerful than the Aedra, aren’t immortal. They can be killed, just not in the realm of Mundus. They can only be killed in their realm of Oblivion. 

Now, looking at immortality from the perspective of souls, rather than physical forms, we get a very interesting outcome. In the case of dragons, they’re considered ‘immortal’ because even if their bodies die and decay, their souls continue to exist. But by this definition, so do the ‘mortal’ races. If a Nord dies, his soul lives eternally in Sovngarde, Mortals who pledged themselves to the service of Daedra will find their souls living eternally in the realm of Oblivion of their chosen Daedra. Souls may be trapped and exist forever inside of Soul Cairns. So using that model, ALL creatures ‘could’ be immortal. Except the Aedra. The Aedra have no special place to go when they die. No Soul Cairn, or realm of Oblivion where they will continue to exist. They simply die. Vanish. Gone forever, like their Et’Ada siblings who faded away into nothing. 

My take on this is that the Divines are rather powerless, by comparison. Sure, no one has ever killed a god, but this doesn’t mean it’s not possible to do so. After all, if Tamriel is known for anything, it should be that every era or so, someone comes along and achieves the otherwise impossible. 

This is why I say the gods are not immortal. 


Malice Mace
February 7, 2016

No, the gods aren't immortal. Powerful in their own right, but not the most powerful beings on Nirn. They aren't omnipotent, or even benevolent. (Akatosh created Alduin to end Nirn. Basically to kill every living thing on the planet) They aren't worthy of worship really. 

by Malice Mace
February 7, 2016

No, the gods aren't immortal. Powerful in their own right, but not the most powerful beings on Nirn. They aren't omnipotent, or even benevolent. (Akatosh created Alduin to end Nirn. Basically to kill every living thing on the planet) They aren't worthy of worship really. 


Malboviing
February 7, 2016

Not really 

by Malboviing
February 7, 2016

Not really 


Duryoljot
February 8, 2016

I always agreed with my friends the Dunmer, many Daedra are more worthy of worship than the Divines.

The Divines just like to mess with you, the Daedra always seem to praise you... 

Is there any way the Divine's power could be restored, besides the destruction of Mundus and their twisted circle of life? Say, if more Daedric princes and Daedra were slain forever... Could it be possible to empower the gods by purging more Planes of Oblivion? By hallowing them? I feel like the gods could do better if their essential opposites were eliminated. And vice versa. But I'm no expert on the higher forces of the Elder... Oh, wait... The Elder Scrolls... The things that can give mortals god like abilites... Loopholes, anyone?

by Duryoljot
February 8, 2016

I always agreed with my friends the Dunmer, many Daedra are more worthy of worship than the Divines.

The Divines just like to mess with you, the Daedra always seem to praise you... 

Is there any way the Divine's power could be restored, besides the destruction of Mundus and their twisted circle of life? Say, if more Daedric princes and Daedra were slain forever... Could it be possible to empower the gods by purging more Planes of Oblivion? By hallowing them? I feel like the gods could do better if their essential opposites were eliminated. And vice versa. But I'm no expert on the higher forces of the Elder... Oh, wait... The Elder Scrolls... The things that can give mortals god like abilites... Loopholes, anyone?


volzah zol
February 8, 2016

I'm not sure the destruction of Mundus would restore their power. I think it would destroy them. Something Akatosh should've thought out a little more before creating Alduin. Like the Daedra being able to be killed in their realm of Oblivion, Mundus is now the Divine's realm. Remember that Mundus is the mortal realm, and the Divines are mortal. 

 

I am disappointed that the moderator who wanted to debate this on the Dwemer thread hasn't made an appearance on this one. I was looking forward to a good debate. 

by volzah zol
February 8, 2016

I'm not sure the destruction of Mundus would restore their power. I think it would destroy them. Something Akatosh should've thought out a little more before creating Alduin. Like the Daedra being able to be killed in their realm of Oblivion, Mundus is now the Divine's realm. Remember that Mundus is the mortal realm, and the Divines are mortal. 

 

I am disappointed that the moderator who wanted to debate this on the Dwemer thread hasn't made an appearance on this one. I was looking forward to a good debate. 


Duryoljot
February 9, 2016

Yeah, Liis is kind of on and off. Especially on the forums... The Hearth is more his place based on what I've seen of him.  But at least you have your faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaavorite sooooooooon!!!

by Duryoljot
February 9, 2016

Yeah, Liis is kind of on and off. Especially on the forums... The Hearth is more his place based on what I've seen of him.  But at least you have your faaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaavorite sooooooooon!!!


Duryoljot
February 16, 2016

Volzah: *pulls the trigger*

by Duryoljot
February 16, 2016

Volzah: *pulls the trigger*

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