Thuum.org

A community for the dragon language of The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

Thuum.org

A community for the dragon language of The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

Are there female dragons? A theory and analysis.

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Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Are there female dragons? This is a question asked frequently by fans of Skyrim and the answer is unfortunately not quite so simple as yes or no. Dragons are physically asexual, lacking reproductive organs of any kind. So if you ask this question in terms of sex the answer is "no" but by this definition there are also no males. Gender identity however, whilst influenced by the physical body, is not solely determined by it and thus opens up more possibilities. In both the real world and in The Elder Scrolls universe we see examples of people whose gender identity is not based off of their bodies. The most relevant examples here are Aedra and Daedra. Daedric princes have no inherent form and thus no sex yet they all appear to identify with gender. Most princes are consistent with their presentation as either masculine or feminine but others (most notably Boethiah and Mephala) change between them. The Aedric gods appear to identify with gender also. So what does this mean for dragons? They likely follow the same "rules". Dragons can identify as masculine, feminine, both, neither or anything in between. I myself hypothesize that most dragons are like dremora whereby most identify as masculine but some will identify as feminine. The other possibility is that few or none of these beings actually identify with any gender but are given them by mortals but this seems less likely. So in conclusion, short answer: No. Long answer: yes.

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Are there female dragons? This is a question asked frequently by fans of Skyrim and the answer is unfortunately not quite so simple as yes or no. Dragons are physically asexual, lacking reproductive organs of any kind. So if you ask this question in terms of sex the answer is "no" but by this definition there are also no males. Gender identity however, whilst influenced by the physical body, is not solely determined by it and thus opens up more possibilities. In both the real world and in The Elder Scrolls universe we see examples of people whose gender identity is not based off of their bodies. The most relevant examples here are Aedra and Daedra. Daedric princes have no inherent form and thus no sex yet they all appear to identify with gender. Most princes are consistent with their presentation as either masculine or feminine but others (most notably Boethiah and Mephala) change between them. The Aedric gods appear to identify with gender also. So what does this mean for dragons? They likely follow the same "rules". Dragons can identify as masculine, feminine, both, neither or anything in between. I myself hypothesize that most dragons are like dremora whereby most identify as masculine but some will identify as feminine. The other possibility is that few or none of these beings actually identify with any gender but are given them by mortals but this seems less likely. So in conclusion, short answer: No. Long answer: yes.


Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Extra: for those who haven't played Oblivion and seen female dremora here is proof

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Races

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Dremora

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Extra: for those who haven't played Oblivion and seen female dremora here is proof

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Races

https://en.uesp.net/wiki/Oblivion:Dremora


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
Since the word "gender" itself comes from a word that meant to produce (see "gen" in "hydrogen", "generate", "genitive"), I disagree with its nonphysical connotations. I think there are only masculine and feminine dragons, but no male nor female.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
Since the word "gender" itself comes from a word that meant to produce (see "gen" in "hydrogen", "generate", "genitive"), I disagree with its nonphysical connotations. I think there are only masculine and feminine dragons, but no male nor female.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Well, that may be it's origin but this is how it's used these days, to refer to identity. Regardless of terminology meaning here is the same. Although, perhaps it would be more PC to edit it to masculine and femine?

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Well, that may be it's origin but this is how it's used these days, to refer to identity. Regardless of terminology meaning here is the same. Although, perhaps it would be more PC to edit it to masculine and femine?


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
It's not used that way by a lot of people. Just because you know people who use it that way, that doesn't mean that's how it's used unanimously and is the standard.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
It's not used that way by a lot of people. Just because you know people who use it that way, that doesn't mean that's how it's used unanimously and is the standard.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

If you know a more correct term I'm happy to edit it. I want to convey the concept as correctly as possible and I don't want to offend the LGBTQ community. :)

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

If you know a more correct term I'm happy to edit it. I want to convey the concept as correctly as possible and I don't want to offend the LGBTQ community. :)


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
Offending the LGBTQ community is as inevitable as death. I say this as a lesbian. I already gave you a term for each, I thought.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
Offending the LGBTQ community is as inevitable as death. I say this as a lesbian. I already gave you a term for each, I thought.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

I suppose I knew it would happen no matter what I wrote. Krosis if I have offended you. I can change it now. :)

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

I suppose I knew it would happen no matter what I wrote. Krosis if I have offended you. I can change it now. :)


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
You don't have to change anything. This is an opinion-related thread, so I gave my opinion.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
You don't have to change anything. This is an opinion-related thread, so I gave my opinion.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

And it makes sense. The less hate I get for posting this the better. I've just changed some parts to better fit with this.

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

And it makes sense. The less hate I get for posting this the better. I've just changed some parts to better fit with this.


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
"Hate" sounds a little extreme when someone simply has a different opinion.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
"Hate" sounds a little extreme when someone simply has a different opinion.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

I don't mean people who have different opinions, the best science comes from questioning and disagreement. I think you can guess the sort of people mean.

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

I don't mean people who have different opinions, the best science comes from questioning and disagreement. I think you can guess the sort of people mean.


Liis
Moderator
December 13, 2018
The sort of people who would convey my sort of opinion hatefully.
by Liis
December 13, 2018
The sort of people who would convey my sort of opinion hatefully.

Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Pretty much. The "my opinion is the only valid one so you must go die in a hole" sort of people. I hope that everyone can debate this civilly but this is the internet after all.

by Sonaak Kroinlah
December 13, 2018

Pretty much. The "my opinion is the only valid one so you must go die in a hole" sort of people. I hope that everyone can debate this civilly but this is the internet after all.


paarthurnax
Administrator
December 21, 2018
If you get into some of the deeper lore, the answer is "yes, sort of"; female dragons are called Jills, and mend breaks in time:

https://www.imperial-library.info/category/tags/jills

What "male" and "female" really mean regarding dragons is obviously up for debate.
by paarthurnax
December 21, 2018
If you get into some of the deeper lore, the answer is "yes, sort of"; female dragons are called Jills, and mend breaks in time:



https://www.imperial-library.info/category/tags/jills



What "male" and "female" really mean regarding dragons is obviously up for debate.
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